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APA-Lite or Session Rye


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#1 Seven

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 10:21 AM

Or is it an American Mild? Regardless, I've been contemplating brewing a light, hoppy but somewhat balanced beer that I can drink a lot of. With this in mind, I picked up a few ingredients from the LHBS. How does this sound?

 

For a 5 gallon batch

3# Maris Otter (37.5%)

3# Munich (37.5%)

2# Rye (25.0%)

Estimated OG 1.041 FG 1.010

ABV 4.0%

 

.20 ounce Challenger (60)

.50 ounce Columbus (60)

.50 ounce Citra (10)

.50 ounce Amarillo (10)

.50 Columbus (WP)

.50 Citra (WP)

.50 Amarillo (WP)

 

US-05 (although I have some S-04 in primarily that I can harvest this weekend)

 

The Challenger doesn't really fit but it's a leftover from a recent stout and I figured I would throw it in for the 60 minute addition. AA from the 60 minute additions total around 42, which may throw this out of balance a bit. Without going back to the LHBS, I have an ounce each of Columbus, Citra and Amarillo to work with. I also have an extra pound of rye and multiple 10+ year old specialty grains.


Edited by Seven, 14 April 2017 - 10:22 AM.


#2 Bklmt2000

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 12:42 PM

Looks good as is.  I'd run with the recipe as posted.

 

For yeast, I'd be curious to see how it did with S-04.  Might add some nice character beyond what US-05 would bring to the table.



#3 Seven

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 12:50 PM

Thanks! I'm a bit worried about the S-05 attenuating too much, even with mashing high. Munich and MO should leave some maltiness behind but will it be enough? Would the S-04 make this too English?

 

If I harvest the S-04, how long can it sit in the fridge before I use it? I'm not sure when I'll brew this one but I plan on kegging my coffee stout tomorrow.



#4 Bklmt2000

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 01:46 PM

Thanks! I'm a bit worried about the S-05 attenuating too much, even with mashing high. Munich and MO should leave some maltiness behind but will it be enough? Should be plenty.  Would the S-04 make this too English? Nope.

 

If I harvest the S-04, how long can it sit in the fridge before I use it? If you use it in less than a month post-harvest, no starter needed.  More than a month, consider a small wake-up starter. I'm not sure when I'll brew this one but I plan on kegging my coffee stout tomorrow.



#5 neddles

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 02:02 PM

What Bklmt2000 said. Keep the S-04 cool and you will greatly limit any English character IME.



#6 HVB

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 06:49 AM

What Bklmt2000 said. Keep the S-04 cool and you will greatly limit any English character IME.

I have been using S-04 at about 68 and do not find much English about it.  Granted, this is for NE style beers and the amount of hops may be covering it but I do not necessarily believe it has be fermented cool.

 

Just my $0.02

 

The beer in the OP looks good to me.  Although I would opt for a 30 Minute boil and ditch the WP hops :)

 

Any dryhopping plans for this?



#7 Seven

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 08:37 AM

I kegged my stout on Saturday and completely forgot to harvest the S-04, so this one will be done with a new pack of S-05. I found a 5+ year old gallon of my dad's homemade wine so I felt obligated to start working on disposal of said wine. I guess I tend to forget things when I'm drinking.

 

I've been thinking about cutting back on my boil times and this seems like a good candidate to experiment with. I'll play with the boil-off calculator in ProMash and adjust my water needs. Do you think that DH would be a better use of the hops vs. whirlpooling? I guess I can do both and either cut back on amounts or pick up more hops from the shop. I need to figure out my water so I'll likely have to pick up some mash additives and some acid anyway. I've never adjusted water before.



#8 HVB

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 08:41 AM

I have been getting away from WP over that last few hoppy beers and do not miss it.  One thing I have been playing with is putting the WP hops in the fermenter and then adding the wort on top of them and let them "steep" a bit as the wort comes to pitching temps.  I have to test it out more but it is promising for me.

 

I would use the WP hops in the dh but that is me and I am sure others will tell me I am crazy :)



#9 positiveContact

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 07:41 AM

this is a good candidate for a 30 min boil. the jury at my house is still out on WP but I kind of suspect I prefer dry hop to WP hop.  maybe do a small flameout addition when you chill it and then really nail it with a dry hop!



#10 HVB

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 07:59 AM

this is a good candidate for a 30 min boil. the jury at my house is still out on WP but I kind of suspect I prefer dry hop to WP hop.  maybe do a small flameout addition when you chill it and then really nail it with a dry hop!

I have gone back to a 0 minute and that sits for 5-10 maybe while I am getting everything ready to chill.  I am not dropping the temps on that addition to 170ish.  That and a big old DH work best for my tastes.



#11 positiveContact

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:04 AM

I have gone back to a 0 minute and that sits for 5-10 maybe while I am getting everything ready to chill.  I am not dropping the temps on that addition to 170ish.  That and a big old DH work best for my tastes.

 

I don't hesitate to chill but the hops go in when the boil is still going on.  it probably takes 5 mins or so for me to get to 170ish.  maybe what I'm doing is kind of a hybrid flameout/hop stand since my chilling is kind of slow by most people's standards.  50' of copper tubing offers a lot of resistance!



#12 HVB

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:41 AM

I don't hesitate to chill but the hops go in when the boil is still going on.  it probably takes 5 mins or so for me to get to 170ish.  maybe what I'm doing is kind of a hybrid flameout/hop stand since my chilling is kind of slow by most people's standards.  50' of copper tubing offers a lot of resistance!

I am only waiting because I am trying to get a few things set up and it just takes some times to move a couple things over.  I will be making some tweaks to eliminate that bottleneck.



#13 Seven

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 10:30 AM

Thanks for the feedback. So, with a shorter boil, I'll need to increase the bittering charge to account for the decreased boil. Should I keep the 10 minute "flavoring" addition or move the rest to flameout plus dry hop?

 

What kind of water profile should I be shooting for here? My wife is heading to the outlets on Sunday so I think I can get this done while she's away!



#14 positiveContact

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 10:47 AM

Thanks for the feedback. So, with a shorter boil, I'll need to increase the bittering charge to account for the decreased boil. Should I keep the 10 minute "flavoring" addition or move the rest to flameout plus dry hop?

 

What kind of water profile should I be shooting for here? My wife is heading to the outlets on Sunday so I think I can get this done while she's away!

 

yes on increase the bittering charge.  I think you usually have to increase by about 50% but let the calculator work it out for you.  the flavor additions are really up to you.  all of that stuff is personal preference.  I still sometimes do 10 min additions but on something that is supposed to mostly be hoppy I tend to do mostly 0 min and dry hop now.



#15 Seven

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Posted 24 April 2017 - 11:43 AM

Brewed this yesterday with a slight alteration to the hop additions; grain bill remained the same as the original post.

 

.20 ounce Challenger - 30 minutes

.25 ounce each Columbus, Citra and Amarillo - FWH, 10 minutes and during chilling (although my temps dropped quicker than expected and the wort was around 125F when added). I will dry hop with the same combination

 

OG came in at 1.044, so a bit higher than expected. This is the 1st time I've made mineral and acid additions to my water. I played around with Bru'N Water and added 6g gypsum and 1g calcium chloride to my strike water and 5g gypsum, 1g calcium chloride and 1.2ml lactic acid to the sparge water. This should have resulted in 137 ppm calcium, 230 ppm sulfate, 48 chloride. We'll see what happens but the wort smelled great and tasted pretty nice.

 

Questions...since I batch sparged, did I really need the lactic acid? My 2 runnings were just about equal in size. Could I have added the sparge mineral additions to the mash or would that have lowered the ph too much? Would I have added them to the kettle instead?

 

Thanks!



#16 positiveContact

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Posted 25 April 2017 - 03:50 AM

Brewed this yesterday with a slight alteration to the hop additions; grain bill remained the same as the original post.

 

.20 ounce Challenger - 30 minutes

.25 ounce each Columbus, Citra and Amarillo - FWH, 10 minutes and during chilling (although my temps dropped quicker than expected and the wort was around 125F when added). I will dry hop with the same combination

 

OG came in at 1.044, so a bit higher than expected. This is the 1st time I've made mineral and acid additions to my water. I played around with Bru'N Water and added 6g gypsum and 1g calcium chloride to my strike water and 5g gypsum, 1g calcium chloride and 1.2ml lactic acid to the sparge water. This should have resulted in 137 ppm calcium, 230 ppm sulfate, 48 chloride. We'll see what happens but the wort smelled great and tasted pretty nice.

 

Questions...since I batch sparged, did I really need the lactic acid? My 2 runnings were just about equal in size. Could I have added the sparge mineral additions to the mash or would that have lowered the ph too much? Would I have added them to the kettle instead?

 

Thanks!

 

all of that just in your mash sounds like it would have been too much.  I can't comment on if you need to treat your sparge water or not.  many people don't need to for batch sparging but that isn't quite universal.  you can reduce the need by making your mash thinner and your sparge a little smaller.  this would also allow you to put more gypsum and CaCl into the mash if you wanted more mineral content in the final product.



#17 Seven

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 10:10 AM

Kegged this beer after around 2.5 weeks and it tasted nice going into the keg. SG 1.044, FG, 1.008 so the S-05 attenuated quite a bit despite the 155F mash temp. The beer is possibly a little more bitter than anticipated but I think getting it cold will smooth that out. The beer was still incredibly cloudy, though. It was dry-hopped about 7-8 days ago but the cloudiness didn't look like hop debris. Is it possible that the short, 30 minute boil is to blame for the cloudiness? I forgot to add Irish moss so that's not helping matters. I'm hoping that a few days in the fridge will help this clear up. If it doesn't, is there anything I can add to clarify it? I have some polyclar at home from many years ago but I've never used it. The beer is on CO2 now.

 

Thanks!



#18 johnpreuss

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 10:32 AM

I've used Polyclar in the past with success.  Another idea would be to get it cold and use gelatin.  You may or may not want to do another dry hop after the gel because some have reported the gel will take some off the hoppiness.  



#19 HVB

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 10:41 AM

I do plenty of 30 minute boils and do not have issues with cloudy beer, unless I want them to be.  Give biofine clear a try, a small amount will go a long way.  S-05 does take some time to drop in my experiance.

 

Some examples

 

17201402_10156106861754657_8947968080826

13315453_10155072984399657_4181422161393

13177324_10155027880309657_4784355988280



#20 neddles

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Posted 11 May 2017 - 11:21 AM

Is Rye malt considered a high protein malt? I would think that between that, the lack of kettle finings and a dry hop your going to get a solid haze in there. In my experience dry hopping on a protein haze is going to get you a near permanent haze. Was the beer hazy before it hit the dry hops? Could still be a delicious beer though.




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