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Operation: Shrink Footprint


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#1 BrewerGeorge

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 09:05 AM

Brainstorm time, Folks!

 

As I get back into brewing my goals are to make good/excellent beer while minimizing my equipment and storage space in the garage.  With soaping stuff now taking up space and the wife letting me know in no uncertain terms that she is no longer willing to park outside in the winter, I need to come up with at least one free garage bay.

 

I've already removed my mill from its dedicated, motorized table and mounted it to the side of the brewcart for hand-cranked operation.  I'll try the drill next time, too, but it was dead from all the building this weekend.  The mill was mounted on a repurposed Craftsman table saw, so that saved quite a lot of space.

 

I've decided that I'm only going to stock one tote's worth of grain instead of two 30 gallon cans and 4-6 bags of grain.  At the moment that means 2-row is in stock and I buy specialties as needed.  I could probably fit another bag of wheat in the tote, but it would be crowded.

 

The current setup has two Cube coolers, MLT and HLT.  I'm going to can starters this week (or weekend if I get busy) and I'm going to try no-sparge to see how efficient it is.  If I can get into the 70's I won't need the MLT, which will free up the whole bottom shelf on the cart for storage of other gear.

 

Which brings me to chillers.  I've got two copper IMCs currently.  There's an older 3/8" one and a newer 1/2" one with provision to pump wort back into the kettle and establish a swirl.  (And if chill water is too hot, the 3/8" one can go inline in front of the 1/2" one in an ice bath...)  Those take up a lot of space, as you can imagine.  I'm thinking of replacing both of those with a stainless counterflow chiller.  I originally used a CFC years ago, but ditched it because of low flow rates and concerns about cleaning "inside" it.  But the flow rates turn out to be unimportant because I'm ultimately taking 20-30 minutes to chill with the IMC's anyway.  Stainless makes the cleaning aspect less vital, too.  What do you think of the idea of replacing the copper IMCs with a stainless CFC?  

 

If I do it, do you think a 20 plate chiller would be okay?  Do you think it would be worthwhile to recirculate the CFC outback back into the kettle?  The main goal being to leave cold break behind in the kettle.  I don't know whether the increase in rate of heat exchange from higher wort flow rate would make up for the lower average rate of heat exchange caused by the lower average wort temp.  I guess I could test it easily. 

 

Any other thoughts to minimize footprint, I'd love to hear them.  I'm keeping both fridges just because it's not cost effective to change them, but everything else is up for grabs.



#2 HVB

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 09:11 AM

I tried 2 or 3 plates and gave up.  I was worried about clogging.  I have a full copper CFC that I have had no issues with . I will pump back into the kettle to drop the temp for whirl pooling and flow is not really and option.  All my break material goes into the fermenter and I have not noticed any issues.

 

I use these totes for grain storage.  I can fit in 2 55# sacks with a little room left for other grain if I want.

 

I think your plan to try no sparge will be your best bet in clearing up some space.



#3 djinkc

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 01:54 PM

This sits on top of my Coleman cooler when in use.  Otherwise it hangs on the wall in the garage.

 

https://i878.photobu...ew/DSCF0079.jpg


Edited by djinkc, 05 September 2017 - 01:55 PM.


#4 denny

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 02:39 PM

Plate chillers may be the biggest PITA I've encountered in homebrewing.  I wouldn't use one of it was free.



#5 BrewerGeorge

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 03:07 PM

Sounds like that's settled then. ;)

#6 HVB

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 03:19 PM

Plate chillers may be the biggest PITA I've encountered in homebrewing. I wouldn't use one of it was free.


I should have learned the first time and I went back to learn it again... Lol

#7 djinkc

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 03:40 PM

Plate chillers may be the biggest PITA I've encountered in homebrewing.  I wouldn't use one of it was free.

 

 

Sounds like that's settled then. ;)

 

 

I should have learned the first time and I went back to learn it again... Lol

 

I like mine.  QDs for all the connections



#8 denny

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 12:47 PM

I like mine.  QDs for all the connections

 

I spent more time cleaning and unclogging it than I saved using it.  My Hydra is just as fast as a plate.



#9 BrewerGeorge

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Posted 10 September 2017 - 05:04 PM

...

 

I think your plan to try no sparge will be your best bet in clearing up some space.

I did a no-sparge today for starters, which are canning now.  Six gallons of strike water into 7.5 lbs of pale.  Efficiency was roughly 78% - roughly because my measurements of volume are rougher than usual because the wort didn't go into the kettle.  I think I actually struck with about 6-1/4 gallons because I got an extra quart of wort, and the lower OG to go with it.  So I've got 21 quarts of 1.038 wort lined up to cycle through the canner with 8 in there now.

 

Bottom line, though, is that I didn't seem to lose any efficiency with the no-sparge.  It was right in line with where I'd expected it with single-batch sparging.  Next time I brew (next weekend, probably) I'll give the no-sparge a test on a real beer.

 

The only question now is, "What do I do with my HLT?"



#10 Bklmt2000

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Posted 10 September 2017 - 05:10 PM

I spent more time cleaning and unclogging it than I saved using it.  My Hydra is just as fast as a plate.

 

I'm giving the Hydra chiller a close, close look. 

 

I have my original, 25' copper IC from 2002 that has seen better days, and the word I've heard re: Hydra has been mighty compelling.



#11 Deerslyr

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 02:23 PM

Jumping into this late.  Had a buddy with a plate chiller, so he bequeathed his home built CFC to me.  A couple of observations...

 

He never had issues with his plate chilller.  After every session he would backflush it and it would be fine.  Keep in mind, he was also using a pump to push the wort through.

 

The CFC he gave me was awesome.  I think the only reason I can think that he went to the plate chiller was for the very footprint issue you are having because that CFC he made was a beast.  I still have it, but don't use it because my Grainfather came with a CFC as well.  

 

I'd add a pump to the system if you can.  



#12 BrewerGeorge

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 03:18 PM

I have a pump already.

#13 Deerslyr

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:53 AM

I have a pump already.

I'm a big proponent of using a pump.  It will go a long way to reducing your footprint.



#14 denny

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:27 AM

I have a pump already.

 

Then get a Hydra with a recirc arm. As fast as a CFC or plate with less maintenance.



#15 HVB

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:31 AM

Then get a Hydra with a recirc arm. As fast as a CFC or plate with less maintenance.


I still don't see how a CFC has a lot of maintenance. Rinse after using and done.

#16 matt6150

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:37 AM

I still don't see how a CFC has a lot of maintenance. Rinse after using and done.

Yep.

#17 denny

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:52 AM

I still don't see how a CFC has a lot of maintenance. Rinse after using and done.

 

I'm basing it on the fact that my Grainfather CFC takes more maintenance than just hosing off my Hydra.  So, for me at least, the CFC takes more time.



#18 HVB

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:58 AM

I'm basing it on the fact that my Grainfather CFC takes more maintenance than just hosing off my Hydra. So, for me at least, the CFC takes more time.


I have an adapter for my hose that hooks up to the CFC, turn on the water and done.

#19 BrewerGeorge

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:25 AM



Then get a Hydra with a recirc arm. As fast as a CFC or plate with less maintenance.

I guess I basically have one of those already that I built myself.  I haven't been using it since I started back up because the older, smaller one was easier to clean up, but I could certainly put it back in circulation (hehe).  And it does store inside the kettle.



#20 denny

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:46 AM

I guess I basically have one of those already that I built myself.  I haven't been using it since I started back up because the older, smaller one was easier to clean up, but I could certainly put it back in circulation (hehe).  And it does store inside the kettle.

 

Is yours 3 coils connected to a single in and out?  That's what makes the Hydra so efficient.




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